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From The Times
July 7, 2008

Day of reckoning for Anglicans amid split over women bishops

Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent

The Church of England will today be plunged into one of the fiercest debates in its 400-year history as traditionalists go head-to-head with liberals over women bishops. Church leaders will attempt to avert new splits with a compromise plan for “super bishops” to minister to traditionalists who oppose women bishops.

Liberals will fiercely resist the plan, which is being seen as an attempt to appease traditionalists in order to get women bishops consecrated.

Campaigners for women's ordination will respond with an all-or-nothing proposal to consecrate women that includes no safeguards or concessions at all for opponents.

More than 1,300 clergy have threatened to walk out if the Church goes ahead with approving the consecration of women bishops without statutory provision to safeguard the traditionalists' place in the Church.

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Women and liberals insist that they would rather not have women bishops at all than have a new, extra-geographical diocese legally established as a safe haven for Anglo-Catholics.

The Archbishops of Canterbury and York, Dr Rowan Williams and Dr John Sentamu, are understood to favour a compromise that would avoid an exodus of the Church's Catholic wing, but they do not want the consecration of women jettisoned altogether because of the difficulties in appeasing both sides.

Dr Williams yesterday described the “agonies and complexities” facing the Church as it struggles with the issues of homosexual priests and women bishops. Preaching to members of the General Synod at York Minster, he said that, were Jesus present in the debate, he would be with every faction of the Church, including traditionalists.

“He will be with those in very different parts of the landscape who feel that things are closing in, that their position is under threat and their liberties are being taken away by those anxious and eager to enforce new ideologies in the name of Christ,” he said.

“He will be with those who feel that their liberty of questioning is under threat, he will be with gay clergy who wonder what their future is in a Church so anxious and tormented about this issue.”

His sermon, which left some worshippers close to tears, restored some faith in its mission as a Christian Church to a Synod meeting where the misery has been almost palpable, as different factions struggle to remain in communion with each other while staying true to their beliefs.

In a last-minute rescue attempt, a senior bishop will urge the Church's governing body to placate traditionalists by considering the appointment of three senior clerics to lead a “Church within a Church”. The Bishop of Ripon and Leeds, the Right Rev John Packer, will propose an amendment that would allow the creation of complementary or “super bishops”. Traditionalist parishes would be allowed to opt into the care of the super bishops - as they can do now with flying bishops, who were set up when women were first ordained.

He is seeking a delay of eight months before the Church makes up its mind. His amendment will also allow the Church to fall back on straightforward legislation, with a code of practice, if the concept of super bishops cannot be made to work.

Dr Miranda Thelfall-Holmes, chaplain at Durham and representing the universities on the General Synod, will put down a rival amendment designed to remove altogether any protection for traditionalists and to have women consecrated by a simple measure or law allowing them to become bishops.

Christina Rees, of the lobby group Watch, which has campaigned for women bishops and who will speak in support of Dr Threlfall-Holmes's amendment, criticised Bishop Packer's proposal as unnecessary. She said: “We do not need further time. Synod is ready to make up its mind about how it wants to proceed. I am in favour of simple statutory arrangements to allow women to be bishops. Anything that muddles this and makes it more complex or changes the nature of what it means to be a bishop in the Church should be resisted.”

Under the compromise tabled by Bishop Packer, the new super bishops would have powers similar to flying bishops but with more authority. He said the proposal meant that the Church would not be divided. “The parishes that put themselves under the care of a complementary bishop would still be part of the local deanery and diocese and would continue to be funded through the diocese and to be in a structure of fellowship with their neighbours.”

The super bishops would care for traditionalist bishops and congregations in the same way flying bishops have done to date, but would also perform consecrations as well as ordinations and other pastoral duties for Anglo-Catholic parishes. This means that, in the eyes of Anglo-Catholics, the “apostolic” ministry would not be “tainted” by the hands of a woman. Traditionalists believe that the actions of Jesus in appointing 12 men as His disciples - as well as centuries of Church tradition - mean that women bishops go against Church order.

The move for a compromise came as a senior Roman Catholic priest cast doubt over claims of high-level consultations that are said to have taken place between Church of England bishops and Vatican officials in Rome. Monsignor Andrew Faley, ecumenical officer to the 22 Catholic bishops of England and Wales and the Catholic observer at the General Synod, said that no information had reached him or his bishops about such a meeting, although informal meetings took place regularly between bishops and lay members of both churches.

Bishops from both the Church of England's evangelical and Catholic wings are said to have held a secret meeting in Rome to discuss the Church's difficulties over women and gays. Up to six bishops, who have not been named, bypassed leaders of the Roman Catholic Church in Britain to hold the consultation with officials from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith at the Vatican.

"Why not just accept that men and women are equal but different and designed by God to have different roles in life."

Classic doublethink. Humanity is designed as an heteropatriarchally and hierarchically. Scripture is consistent and clear even in the face of inordinate levels of feminist sophistry

James, london, uk

If Jesus had been born a female, would there have been christianity or indeed the Anglican Church ?
Super is being used here, I thought Christianity was about humility,compassion for your fellow beings.
Not predjudice against your fellow beings, because of gender, colour, class, or disabilities,

pauline, Tendering, Essex

I don't think this body is really the Church.First of all, no fruit of the Spirit.And the real Church doesn't question basic scripture,let alone stumble people by individual ambition and then vote to impose what half count as offenses. No charity or salt--those who love God left long ago.

M.A., Monterey , US

I agree with Leonard Kramer. Bishop Williams is simply not reasoning rightly with regards the drift of his denomination. My goodness, the GAFCON meeting in Jerusalem should have given him pause. Jesus is for Truth. His Truth. That is what is at stake. Whatever stands against it stands against him.

Robert Buechler, Starkweather, ND, USA

Any organised religion which distinguishes one sort of person over another because of gender is anti-God.

Thomas Outerbridge, Stoke Mandeville, Bucks

Why is it that the mildest of mainstream religions is so vexed by women and gays, God must have loved them, cause he made so many of them, to quote the Rev. Andrew Mead St. Thomas 5th Avenue.

RD, San Miguel de Allende, Mexico

The Word of God is Truth Universal - it should not be changed with different trends and fashions of the times! The Archbishop of Canterbury should have the moral courage and faith to hold fast to the scripture and ONLY the scripture, instead of being concerned with appeasement and politics!

edwin heng, Singapore, Singapore

Lots of reports of traditionalists who would leave if Synod agrees to women bishops but no mention of those of us who will leave if they don't agree to women bishops - maybe because we don't make so much fuss!

Teresa, Twickenham,

Andrew Chapman: Paul was a man not God - even those appointed by God can get it wrong. Paul's statements merely reflect the times in which he lived. Man also selected which books to include in the Bible - conveniently missing out important ones written by women.

Sarah, Aberdeen,

So, if the anti-women crew get special protection from women bishops, what happens when a woman becomes Archbishop? Do they then get their own archbishop too, without the church splitting? If so why not just do that now? Please let us in on the plan here and save so much embarrassment.

Jenny, Manchester,

Can we see a list of the pay scale for all the different ranks?
I would expect an archbishop to get about the same as a traffic warden, he does as much damage.

M Wilson, Bidache, france

Andrew Chapman, St. Paul also wrote, in Thessalonians, that the apocalypse would happen within the 1st Century. If he was wrong about this, is it possible he could be wrong about women's place in society?

Chris G, London,

The term "Super Bishop" is a bit of a tautology, since the very word "bishop" is itself based on the Greek "episkopos", which literally means an "over-looker". So why this proposed Latin-
Greek mish-mash, meaning "super-over-looker"? What's wrong with "Archbishop"?

Edmund Burke, Kingston upon Thames, England

Every time the Cof E performs these agonising contortions to try and appease the various factions, its authority dwindles away.
Has no-one wondered why the Roman Catholic Church remains so strong, even though it is derided by the modernists? It is because of its unbending message.

A.Chandler, Nelson, New Zealand

Oh you Christians! do you ever read your own book?Try Timothy 1. It is prescriptive for how women should behave in church and refrain from teaching.How can you have women in authority in the church at all? It is a clear blasphemy and the Queen should be removed as the protector.Let's get fundamental

Dr David Archibald, Cairns, Australia

Wow! Designer Churches! Designer Religion! Make it what YOU want! Strip it of its original sense so you can change it into whatever you want so it is "modern"! Why not start the all-women-priest Amazon church? Not many respect anything any more. Traditionalists: unite and defend your rights!

Bichuf, Miami, USA

Interesting... I find it slightly odd how the clergy aren't in it for simply preaching and good works, but now for titles. Does it really matter if one is a priest or bishop or cardinal? The simple fact is that they should all be focusing on more important issues such as working for the poor etc.

Adam, Cincinnati OH, USA

Why not just accept that men and women are equal but different and designed by God to have different roles in life. This whole debate is fomented by the "ambivalents" who seem to resent that difference and the CofE lacks the authority to impose any sort of discipline. What a shame!

David, Cheltenham, UK

In 200 years time, I suspect people will regard this current debate over women bishops with the same sense of wonder as we now view earlier debates over the abolition of slavery and women's suffrage. Does a loving, redeeming God REALLY want us to perpetuate a form of apartheid based on gender?

David Edmiston, Hobart, Australia

Every new days sees the C of E move further away from the apostolic message. Where do you find a super-bishop, or come to think of it an archbishop, in the NT? No women priests either since "priest" isn't recognised in the NT. Why not have women pastors with the right to celebrate and officiate?

Dr David Green, Athens, Greece

Super Bishops...

Two castes of clergy will be created....

Class A ..men ordained by men

Ck;ass B..women and men ordained by women bishops

How both could remain in communion with each other is ridiculous. Super bishps is a quick fix and a long term disaster.

Robert Ian Williams, wrexham, wales, uk

Bob Evans makes a excellent point.
Can't have what I want so I will ruin it for everybody.

Jerry Scroggin, Phoenix, Arizona/USA

Why are there those who would prefer to destroy the church if they cannot intimidate & force the church to change to their way of thinking? Rather than find a church that meets their criteria, they are like petulant & immature children seeking destruction if they cannot have their selfish ways.

Bob Evans, Anaheim, California

As I read and consider the idea of 'Super Bishops'being created in the Anglican Faith, I wonder to myself ... could they not also be called "Cardinals" ?!?!?

Peter Sudbury, peterborough, Canada

Paul wrote that he did not permit women to be teaching nor to have authority over men. Jesus appointed Paul to be a teacher to the Gentiles. Simple. Obey God not man.

Andrew Chapman, Newcastle upon Tyne, England

No wonder the Anglican Church is in crisis. Williams is quoted as saying that if Jesus were "present in the debate, he would be with every faction of the Church..." This is an unreasoning aphorism reflecting no sense of singular truth. Jesus cannot be both for and against women and gay priests

Leonard Kramer, Houston, Texas

Brilliant! Now - will a Super Bishop get to wear tights and a cape rather than a boring old cassock...?

Anna Morell, Norwich, UK

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