Robin Pagnamenta
Download 'Too Hot', an exclusive Specials track from iTunes
The Bank of England's Deputy Governor for Financial Stability has admitted that the central lender failed to grasp the full scale of Britain’s economic problems before the current financial crisis erupted.
In an edition of Panorama, to be screened tonight, Sir John Gieve tells the BBC that the Bank was aware that a bubble was developing in the housing market, as well as in the price of other assets, and that it was being fuelled by “crazy borrowing”.
However, it failed to comprehend how serious the problem really was and what the implications would be for the rest of the economy.
Sir John, who is a member of the Bank's rate-setting Monetary Policy Committee, also criticised the Bank’s policy of relying too heavily on interest rates to control conditions in the banking sector, saying that they were a “blunt instrument”.
“We need to develop some new instruments, which sit somewhere between interest rates, which affect the whole economy... and individual supervision and regulation of individual banks,” he said.
“We need to develop something which bridges that gap and directly addresses the financial cycle and prevents the financial cycle and the credit cycle getting out of hand.”
Sir John, who will step down next year to be replaced by Paul Tucker, claimed that if the Bank had lifted interest rates earlier to rein in the asset price boom, it would have depressed activity in the rest of the economy.
Sir John also raised questions over whether taxpayers would get back all of the money the government has now invested in the banking sector.
"There are some books: Northern Rock, Bradford & Bingley, which the taxpayer's now holding, which clearly have a level of defaults in them, [I'm] not quite sure how that will balance out against the residual of the capital," he said.
"As for the more mainstream banks, yes I think they've got a commercial future and I'm sure that in time they will... revive and start building and growing as commercial entities again."
Sir John, who was criticised by MPs on the Treasury Select Committee last autumn for failing to foresee the developing crisis at Northern Rock, said that the Bank was “learning lessons” from the current economic crisis.
He was appointed deputy governor of the Bank of England in January 2006 and is a member of the board of the Financial Services Authority (FSA).
Articles from our sister site WSJ.com:
You may be asked to subscribe to read certain articles
Win a luxury weekend to Newcastle and its neighbour Gateshead, find out more here
Risk, resilience and embracing new technology
Industry sectors news at a glance. Interactive heatmap, video and podcast
Discover the power of collective thinking. Submit a solution and be in with a chance to win a Media Hub Home Entertainment System
The inside track on current trends in the charity, not for profit and social enterprise sectors
Everything the Business Traveller needs to know to make a better trip
Make the most of the summer and enter our fabulous photographic competition, you could win a £5000 holiday
Corsica is an island of beauty and contrast, an ideal holiday destination
Enjoy further reading from Travel to Fashion, Business to Sport, discover more
Shortcuts to help you find sections and articles
The clever way to lease a new car is with Car leasing made simple™
2009
per month on 36-month
Personal Contract Hire (PCH)
2008
42850
Car Insurance
£24,250 - £30,346
MI5
London
£60,000
The Environment Agency
Bristol
Up to £90K
Boots
Midlands
OTE £85k
Credit Protection Association
Nationwide Opportunities
Completely London
Luxury Condo's in Manhattan with NYC views
The best new homes in Wimbledon?
Nationwide
Fabulous Cruise And Cruise & Stay Offers Including Virgin Atlantic Flights Prices Start From Only £699pp!
Last Minute Cruise And Cruise & Stay Offers. Med From £499pp, Caribbean From £699pp!
5 star quality at a 3 star price.
8 fabulous Canadian cities ...you won’t find cheaper
Contact our advertising team for advertising and sponsorship in Times Online, The Times and The Sunday Times, or place your advertisement.
Times Online Services: Dating | Jobs | Property Search | Used Cars | Holidays | Births, Marriages, Deaths | Subscriptions | E-paper
News International associated websites: Globrix Property Search | Property Finder | Milkround
Copyright 2009 Times Newspapers Ltd.
This service is provided on Times Newspapers' standard Terms and Conditions. Please read our Privacy Policy.To inquire about a licence to reproduce material from Times Online, The Times or The Sunday Times, click here.This website is published by a member of the News International Group. News International Limited, 1 Virginia St, London E98 1XY, is the holding company for the News International group and is registered in England No 81701. VAT number GB 243 8054 69.
We need to develop something which bridges that gap and directly addresses the financial cycle and prevents the financial cycle and the credit cycle getting out of hand. - the answer is simple regulation - there should have to be a minimum deposit enforced for anybody desiring a mortgage.
Richard, Kidderminster, England
We have been brankrupt since 1945, and will always remain so, and?
Unless you are foolish, don't worry your pretty wee heads.
j, london,
Should have been checked in 2005 with a rise in Intrest rates.
Nobody wanted to end the party least of all gordon brown who knew if rates rose in election year then coupled with the gov't unpopularity over the iraq war it may have cost labour the election.Vested intrests and all that.
robert, havant, UK
As part of the usual manipulation of statistics by the idiot Brown, they removed house prices from the inflation measure...so inflation was "low" Hurrah!... so we did not need high interest rates.... so we had a house price boom, with no controlling feedback loop... This is laid squarely on Brown.
Phil A, Headley, UK
Why are these people still employed by the tax payers and drawing 6 figure salaries. This govt. rewards the incompetent - its the only way they can stay in power!
Adi, Reading, UK
Prudence RIP 2008
mike, Cotswolds, UK
I a retired Engineer could see this " Bubble " was developing and could not go on . It was the greed of " The Banks " that fuelled the situation . They could have controlled house prices by insisting upon sensible deposits based on their property valuation ... as happened in the 1960's .
P Maitland, Murton Village , England
We've been taxed year on year, with the government telling us its for our own good. We stop spending, buying/selling houses, cars and start saving, the economy nose dives and the Government is surprised. They then give our money to the people who were overcharging us in the first place. Democracy !
Robert, Shropshire, England
as I understand it Flash Gordon built his reputation on running the economy on a massive bubble of debt which has crippled us ... yet the current problems according to Gordy is wholly an American generated problem.
Could someone PLEASE call Brown on this next time he starts chanting this mantra!
Geo, Glasgow,
If Brown had left things as they were when he inherited the system from Ken Clarke, this calamity would not have occurred. It would have been seen coming.
He was warned repeatedly by the Lib Dems & the Tories 4 years ago of the huge risk of all our debt.
"No. You are wrong & I am right." he said!
Phil, Preston,
Now that doctors are to be trained to recognise dementia, perhaps their
first subjects should be certain politicians and bankers.
K Wells, Bognor Regis, England
If terrorists or some other hostile force damages our country then the state is expected to hit back hard. Why is it holding back now? When the depression is over countless lives will have been ruined but many of the architects of this catastrophe will have gotten away scot free. Unbelievable.
Sam, London,
The top men at the FSA received £650,000 handshakes when found to be incompetent.
Seems rewards for not doing your job under this government is normal.
Ray, Portbail, France
John Gieve has admitted being involved in a mess at the Bank of England, that is ruining the country. Prior to that he was running the Home Office which was found not fit for purpose. Would it not be safer, and less expensive for the country, if he was forced to retire from the civil service, now.
Vinay Mehra, Purley, Surrey
How could the so called financial experts (bankers, Brown and borrowers) not see this coming? I predicted this 5 years ago because quite simply you cannot build a prosperous economy on borrowing? Labour always ends up wrecking the economy.
David, Doncaster, UK
What was his previous job - lookout on the Titanic !
I still find the "credit crunch" difficult to understand, as there are so many banks involved.Surely somebody in a senior position employed by one of them must have wondered about the viability of all that debt.Finally If not why not ?
Mike, Dunstable, England
The bankers broke their own rules in their greed thus causing house prices to rocket as high mortgages were being granted to those who were unable to repay. I forecast this from four years ago and I am a retired engineer, not a finacial expert. Those responsible in the banks should be fired.
B J Deller, Marbella, Spain
"Crazy Borrowing" would not take place if lenders rained in their " Crazy Lending"
Chris James, Cape Town, South Africa
So, the BoE failed to see what was achingly obvious. I believe Blair & Brown have been, as I predicted, a toxic, corrosive force on our economy and the fabric of society. I wonder how many Labour voters still think the working man is better of f under Labour's "prudence". What a mess, of course.
E R Pemberton, Thornbury, England
Local authorities all over the country were giving planning permissions for tens of thousands of 'luxury apartments' for sale at unsustainable prices. Did the BoE not even know what is going on in government?
J Jenkins, York,
The quicker we join the euro the better.
james allen, manchester, england
The admission of the Bank of England's Deputy Governor for Financial Stability is astonishing. I sold my London flat in Feb 2007 as I anticipated the collapse in property values long before, So the Bank could have acted earlier by insisting mortgages should not exceed 80% of property values.
Nick Cotton, West Sussex, UK
How much did we pay this guy when he was in offfice? Did he spend his whole time blind-folded and in ear defenders? Or is this yet another block in Gordon Brown's defence bunker that we all know as ' Chateau Who could have foreseen this?'
Could we please be told more about the separation package?
clive, enfield,
To be fair what exactly could/would the BoE do? They are after all just reactionary policy makers.
If we want free markets then we have to get use to free fall as well.
jon lee, london,
"The Bank of England's Deputy Governor for Financial Stability has admitted that the central lender failed to grasp the full scale of Britains economic problems before the current financial crisis erupted. " Surely this suggests there is an urgent need for some scientific training for bankers.
Dave, Chorley,
Nice to know they're learning lessons. The lesson I've learnt is that you're on your own as a responsible citizen who wants to save and avoid debt. Only property speculators, fraudsters and buy-to-let schemers are looked after by governments.
If you're honest, you've no chance.
MB, Edinburgh,
Brilliant Mr Gieve. You don't have to be an expert to have known this was going to happen. The whole of the city, regulators and Government have vested interests, that's why this occured.
Until these people are all replaced and punished financially nothing will change.
N Matthew, London,
having accepted they are failures why don't they resign?
philip smith, seaford,
Lets be honest El Gordo designed the interests setting policy; and its his goverment thats now forcing the BoE to take the fall. Lets not be fooled how's to blame.
Paul John Graham, Greenwich, UK
Until we realise that most people are underworked and overpaid in the UK, we will still blame emerging economies for making cheap goods. . We are now fully engaged in a global economy, and we need to get used to the situation. Start making essential goods at a competitive price Get real Sir John
Francis Henderson, Arundel, UK
Nonsense, the government simply choose to do nothing, because:
a) it was a popular phenomenon, everyone felt like they were getting rich effortlessly.
b) they believed they could engineer the 'soft landing' where prices would plateau, (which would have been a first in history).
Tom Brewer, Slough, UK
It should have been obvious to everyone that the inflation figures were being kept artificially low by low priced imports from China, that were bound to rise sharply. That coupled with the fact that banks were lending crazy amounts on mortgages should have enough evidence for anyone.
K Wells, Bognor Regis, England
If the Government and BofE had used a more realistic measure of inflation, one which reflected the true cost of living, interest rates would have been set at 7% or 8% over recent years and half the problems we've now got would not have materialised.
Neil Protheroe, Oxford, UK
What use are these regulators and watchdogs if they don't spot the obvious signs of trouble before it becomes a crisis? I cannot recall any occasion when they have heeded warnings and taken action, but plenty of times in the last few years when they ignored the warning bells and we end up paying .
Ken Rodford, Bedford, UK
In 1997 Brown split bank supervision, until then solely the Bk of E's remit, between 1) the Treasury, 2) the B of E, & 3) the FSA. None of them knew what the others were to do so no-one saw N/Rock lending long & borrowing short. Darling admitted he read it in the FT first! Don't they talk to anyone?
Rob Bryant, Bromley, England
JJ-absolutely right. Consistently atrocious judgement by the MPC-perhaps if they were sacked without compensation and their gold-plated final salary pensions reduced by 60%, they could experience what millions are.
Janet, London,
We have all been having a party spending cheap credit on cheap imports backed up by a property bubble. This readjustment is long overdue. If house prices had been included in the RPI index the housing buble would never have developed.
M Wasem, Bath, England
Unbelieveable. The crazy borrowing and risks have seemed obvious for a long time, but I naively assumed my fears were unfounded and that the "experts" in charge - with their (alleged) massive intellects, rarified skills and esoteric knowledge - were in control of the situation. How wrong I was.
Chris K, Cheltenham, UK
Q. We need to develop some new instruments, which sit somewhere between interest rates, which affect the whole economy?
A. How about a deposit of 10 - 15% and a simple check that the borrower has the income to pay the loan back, non bankers would call this good business practice.
Peter Rogers, Rushden, UK
Bank failed to spot crisis despite 'crazy borrowing' - Yeah right. Quite simply, the financial sector was making far too much money out of the boom for anyone to dare try and stop it. The current crunch was the only natural way this was ever going to end. Will it happen again? You betcha!
andy, north,
'crazy borrowing'...... more like crazy lending by commission driven greedy bankers far more concerned about lining their own pockets than following responsible business procedures.
Iain Shorts, Watford, UK
Why are well-paid experts like this still in their jobs (and still being listened to)? If I'd displayed such incompetence in my chosen profession I would be hugely embarrassed and would expect to be demoted, if not subjected to disciplinary action and sacked.
Chris K, Cheltenham, UK
If members of the Bank of England MPC could not forsee the dangers of the housing market bubble they should not have been drawing a wage. This depression did not come a a surprise to everyone. The house price crash will continue and leave the UK with the worlds biggest 'subprime' problem.
Melvin Goldsmith, Maldon, UK
Until imports of cheap foreign 'goods,' and cheap foreign labour,are stopped, it will be next to impossible to restore the economy. These things are all linked, and have been part of a deliberate plan to cause this recession in the first place,
Including obscene amounts of cash given to the banks.
Clive Burghard, Lancing, ENGLAND
If they raised interest in August 2005 instead of lowering them , we would'nt be in this mess. They have no idea of how to regulate. Its about time they got some people onto the MPC who don't have vested interests.
JJ, Lancaster, UK